Wednesday, July 13, 2022

DAVID RATTRAY on THE CORPSE DREAM OF N. PETKOV.

On a dull sort of day I was heartened by re-discovering a letter from the late David Rattray on my novel THE CORPSE DREAM OF N. PETKOV.  I wish I had known about the expanded version of his collected prose as it surely might have found a place there in HOW I BECAME ONE OF THE INVISIBLE.  David was a very rare human being who actually knew how to read and... 


June 18, 1987

Dear Tom, The Corpse Dream of N. Petkov is a tour de force.  I was riveted as they say, although it is a tale I wouldn't want to identify with, I guess I am forced to, willy-nilly.  The 12-minute interior monologue of a man being strangled, compressed into 120 pages or less---I count the dozen-odd pages of documents  as something that  might flash past in a split second--- then the many pages of your autobiographical track, and the interviews, which further whittle it down--- less than half is straight Petkov--- so I tried to imagine all this as a speeded-up tape actually being spoken in the 12 minutes and I believe it is possible even if in a Martian Donald Duck falsetto--- provided Piko's thoughts and rejoinders run in tandem, and the author's voice and documents are flashed onto a wall--- it would fit ---a tight fit, but so is that noose or loop as you consistently call it.  Like Piko I am a raki man; it takes one to appreciate one. The ignoble is also in a state of humiliation.  Apart from this book I had never read a line about Petkov that fool who persisted in showing character. The dream of dying in one's bed with one's hand held is in the papers, on TV, in Reader's Digest. The puff of wind exploding the speck of ash into the air is the reality hitherto reserved for the few, now made available for all.  Have you heard of Bogdan Borkowski's film Le Poeme which shows a dissection in progress to a sound track consisting of an actor's voice declaiming Rimbaud'sDrunken Boat in impassioned tones?   For the man being hanged to imagine a major earthquake reminds me of Kleist's  novella "The Earthquake in Chile" in which the young man has just climbed  upon a stool n his dungeon cell to hang himself on a noose he has fashioned somehow, when the first giant tremor of the great earthquake of sixteen-something causes the building to collapse and lands him unscathed in the street.  Therefore I at first misread your line "An earthquake would get him out of there."  Obviously you are referring to getting Dimitrov out of the saddle, not Petkov out of the noose.  I loved the Hyperborean or Austral icecap fantasy on p62.  Having spent half my life worrying  the lie that creeps in when we are speaking and the abyss between thought, word, and ear, I have to plead for Gosho and Petko and their liking for the sound of their own voice.  Maybe that was their direction finder as it is in a way our direction finder when we share in meetings.  We are all as blind as bats in many ways, and I read that that is precisely how bats do find their way through the maze of pitch blackness--- the sound of their own voice bouncing off obstacles---  it is shows them where to go and where not to go.  "Fly my little bird but remember no bird makes a nest in a cloud."  I was put in mind of Gilbert White in Selkirk the speculation on whether sparrows migrate south in winter or were ravished up into the empyrean where they somehow levitated on the highest clouds.  I really loved your book.

                                             DAVID (Rattray)


Friday, June 17, 2022

ONCE UPON A TIME: The Hollins Critic essay by Daniel J. Tharp on ST. PATRICK'S DAY another day in Dublin by Thomas McGonigle

Yesterday 16 June 2022 another day was celebrated in Dublin for another book about a day in Dublin... 


Thomas McGonigle's two previous novels, The Corpse Dream of N. Petkov (1987) and Going to Patchogue (1992), were reviewed by The New York Times Book Review , the Los Angeles Times , the Chicago Tribune , and The Village Voice Literary Supplement . Given all that early attention, the best thing to do is not to talk at first about Thomas McGonigle's St. Patrick's Day: another day in Dublin , a novel that flaunts a sense of timelessness, but instead to talk about two other artists who exist outside of time: Oscar Peterson and Count Basie.

In 1980, BBC Four broadcast Oscar Peterson: Words and Music , a television show hosted by Peterson during which he performs, hosts performances, and talks about music with legendary jazz guitarist Joe Pass. After Peterson discusses with Pass his experiences playing solo concerts, they discuss the difficulty of playing in a group setting and how no big band has a synched musical phrasing better than Count Basie's big band. The show then goes into a flashback in which Peterson has a head-to-head talk with Count Basie at Festival Hall. After showing off Basie's light touch, the conversation turns to the "musical intimidation" often caused by Art Tatum, who is widely acknowledged to be the greatest jazz pianist to ever exist and who was influential to both Peterson and Count Basie. Peterson recounts how there used to be "great instigations" where, when two pianists were at a bar, people would coax the two to play against each other.


   [Art] went straight to the piano and he like just took it apart

   literally, just wasted everything on the piano.... And he went through

   about ten minutes of something, and just wasted it all and he came

   back over and sat down beside me and said, you know, when I get

   through you can have it. You know he was a total, he was an eagle,

   he was a very proud man, and he should have been. And I don't think

   there's a pianist of that era that wasn't influenced by him.


Peterson continues to explain that, for a long time, whenever Tatum entered the room, he would suffer fits of extreme nervousness, and that once Tatum had told him, "If you have to hate me, if that's what's gonna make you get over this, you'll just have to hate me ... and really ... It wasn't a case of really hating him, I needed to ignore him the best I could, if you can ever ignore--death."

That is what the literary culture in America needs to do, ignore death, and acknowledge that contemporary writers who follow in the footsteps of modernist giants need to be studied and read, and not forgotten or brushed to the side.

The literary world is currently in a metaphorical period of "musical intimidation." Since the Irish writer Samuel Beckett, the term modernism is nigh untouchable, and Beckett's use of modernist techniques to approach human nature and psychological realism could be used to argue the end of the literary time period known as modernism, because no one can take it any further. When Beckett sat down with his instrument, to steal Peterson's phrase, he "took it apart literally, just wasted everything," and when he died in 1989, he sat down and said to the world, "when I'm through, you can have it"; however, this does not mean that contemporary writers who follow in his lineage should be ignored. Like modernism, literary realism is a phrase that is hardly mentioned right now; perhaps, this is because the phrase has little meaning, that is, if words have meaning anymore and are not just currency to prompt bestselling interviews.

During an author talk about craft at the 2017 Association of Writers and Writing Programs held in Washington D.C., Ron Charles, editor of Book World at The Washington Post , asked Jennifer Egan, 2011 Pulitzer Prize winner, and Karen Joy Fowler, 2013 PEN/Faulkner Award winner, to talk about the state of fiction, realism in particular. Fowler's response was [because of President Trump] "The final nail in the coffin has been struck." Egan nodded in agreement. One important reason why Thomas McGonigle's novel St. Patrick's Day: another day in Dublin , among his other works, needs to be read, reviewed, and studied is because his novel reflects a literary lineage that is keeping realism in a timeless present that refuses to be laid in a grave.

To say that McGonigle's newest novel, Saint Patrick's Day: another day in Dublin , directly reflects Beckett would be hyperbolic and would shortchange the importance of a contemporary author's using a writing style that has been deemed by many as outdated, because, as is often is the case with art and architecture in America, to be historical is to be wasting space. Before you can trace McGonigle's novels to Beckett, or Faulkner, or Joyce, you must first look back to a French novelist by the name of Marie-Henri Beyle, known by his pen name Stendhal. In 1839, Beyle published a novel called La Chartreuse de Panne (The Charterhouse of Parma) . The novel follows the life and adventures of an Italian nobleman, Fabrice del Dongo, and, while this novel has since been translated multiple times, it has also been turned into an opera, multiple film-adaptations, and a TV series, and it holds great literary significance, since it is considered by many to be a revolutionary work representing a change from the "romantic style" into a more "realistic style" because of his close exploration into human nature and psychology. This is done throughout the novel by Fabrice's comparing his life to various novels and poems he has read, and by the way in which Beyle juxtaposes paradoxes: long passages of straight description with the Battle of Waterloo, where the totality of the battle slowly accumulates amid Fabrice's confusion; wit with fits of melancholy; politics with idealism, with love, with failed dreams.

These themes and techniques were later employed by James Joyce, most notably in A Portrait of the Artist as a Young Man and Ulysses , both of which might well be two of the most written about Irish novels of all time.

Instead of tarrying over what has already been said about these works, a few specific comparisons can be made between McGonigle's Saint Patrick's Day: another day in Dublin and Joyce's works. This may seem merely verbose on my part at first, but there is a clear intention by the author to reflect the Irish legend. McGonigle told Dr. Miriam Nyhan in an interview on Glucksman Ireland House NYU Radio Hour (early 2017) that, "Joyce is ever present in this book, as he is present in every single person concerning Ireland;" therefore, to ignore Joyce's influence, would be tantamount to skimming the first couple of paragraphs and calling it quits.

Saint Patrick's Day tells the story of one 'Tom McGonigle' and follows him as he wakes up on St. Patrick's Day, journeys through various drinking establishments, and interacts with the characters he meets along the way; so, what you get is a psychologically close rendering of a single man existing after the death of his father, as he drinks away his bequeathed inheritance. This sort of psychological dabbling is reminiscent of the technique used by Joyce to portray Stephen Dedalus in A Portrait of the Artist as a Young Man . The major difference is that, in Portrait , Dedalus has both a spiritual and an artistic awakening, while, in St. Patrick's Day: another day in Dublin , 'McGonigle' does not, even though both characters use literature to directly interact with their past and present (much as Fabrice del Dongo does).

The seeming lack of an awakening by 'Tom McGonigle' in St. Patrick's Day affects the reader in much the same way that waiting for the arrival of Godot in Samuel Beckett's 1953 play Waiting for Godot affects its readers/audiences. By the end, the reader is unsure if he has already been there, or if he is there, or if he will ever come.

Another direct correlation between Joyce and McGonigle is the experimentation with layout and font. In Joyce's Ulysses , this can be seen in Episode Seven: "Aeolus," which takes place at the Freeman newspaper offices. This section begins with the headline: IN THE HEART OF THE HIBERNIAN METROPOLIS. The purpose behind Joyce's using this visual tactic in his writing has been discussed at length: possible intentions of parodying the emptiness of journalism, juxtaposing Bloom with Dedalus; political allegory; and it has even been considered a possible admission of admiration of the newspaper Scissors and Paste which ran in Dublin from 1899-1906. Whatever the reason may be, it cannot be argued that the change in text, in terms of font style and size, is hard to miss.

The same can be said fof the way the McGonigle changes his font. One font size or style might be employed in the exact manner as Joyce, to give headlines, while another is used to recall a written poem, another for a letter, another purely for emphasis. In each instance, the change in font is doing something the words are not. While this might be a challenge for readers as they get used to the mechanics of the novel, much as with the complicated style of Joyce's writing, McGonigle's style can be perceived in the same light, when boiled down: the plot of both "Aeolus" and St. Patrick's Day can be read straightforwardly as though this technique were not employed. This visual style, however, creates a meta-fictional atmosphere as well, the reader having to acknowledge someone outside the narrative crafting the story. The biggest difference between the two is, while the headline style in Ulysses can create confusion or, at the very least, make the textual meaning harder to discern, the font size and style changes in St. Patrick's Day make the passages easier to follow; also, the variety of uses of this visual technique seems to say to the rest of the literary world a reiteration of what Art Tatum said to Oscar Peterson, "... when I'm done you can have it."

In his foreword to his book Re Joyce (1965), Anthony Burgess addresses an issue that is centric not only to Joyce, McGonigle, and academia, but also to the American public: "My book does not pretend to scholarship, only to a desire to help the average reader who wants to know Joyce's work but has been scared off by the professors. The appearance of difficulty is part of Joyce's big joke; the profundities are always expressed in good round Dublin terms; Joyce's heroes are humble men." Difficulty and Joyce's intentions, such as the headlines previously discussed, have been argued about constantly and this quotation is brought up, not to dispute intentions, but to argue that while Joyce's heroes might have been humble men, it can be argued that Joyce, himself, was not so humble. Part of the difficulty with Ulysses is that it operates on one level as a biography and on another as fiction. There is a mythic quality about Joyce that is caused by the details of his life mixing with creativity. The same could be said about McGonigle's work. The presence of biographical facts and fiction in a text written with stream of consciousness as a primary style complicates the text in a way that may make his novel seem more complex to the average reader than it actually is. While this may be a way to make a myth out of a man, it should not scare away potential readers.

When George O'Brian reviewed Saint Patrick's Day for The Dublin Review of Books , Issue 87, he spent much of his time reflecting upon the lines from T.S. Eliot's poem "Burnt Norton." The lines go as follows: "Time present and time past / Are both perhaps present in time future / And time future contained in time past. / If all time is eternally present/All time is unredeemable." O'Brian used these lines to try to explain how the text operates in terms of setting and tense, and O'Brian does explain his point that the character 'Tom McGonigle' is constantly crossing between realms of time and place. O'Brian explains his point exhaustively, but he misses the big picture: a timeless present also describes the literary heritage that McGonigle's novel is consistently referring back to and existing presently in.

McGonigle has claimed the novel is as much fiction as Joyce's work was, that most of the experience is made up and some is real, that all the experience is real and some is made up, and while these claims may seem to be an aloof and dismissive comment about his writing, they, in actuality, explain much about the tense of the book and, perhaps, McGonigle's intentions behind his use of a timeless present tense. In a letter (February 2017), McGonigle responded to a question concerning the direct connection to the Irish writers/monoliths, James Joyce and Samuel Beckett. He stated that,


   Certain writers are always at the shoulder as it is with Beckett,

   Celine, Bernhard, Thomas Wolfe ... but one doesn't write to refute,

   to ... more in the way why repeat what has been done ... it seemed

   to me I have always been interested in what is happening right now

   as opposed to what is going to happen ... so for me that sentence

   right in front of me sends me to the next sentence ... I heard the

   business about what is happening right now from Nicholas Mosley the

   son of Sir Oswald who is a very prolific novelist and whom I

   interviewed for Newsday


.


McGonigle's interview with Nicholas Mosley was published on the 5th of January 1992, and in it Mosley explained to McGonigle that there are two types of books, those about what happens next and those about what happens on the page. To reiterate the basic plot of St. Patrick's Day , the novel is about a man waking up as the St. Patrick's Day parade is ending, who then travels from pub to pub, and does a walkabout through Dublin; however, while this may seem straightforward, McGonigle infuses the text with a recollection of all the years that 'Tom McGonigle' traveled back and forth to Dublin, which creates a timeless-present tense that often demands the reader's full attention.

This technique is reminiscent of not only A Portrait of the Artist as a Young Man but also Faulkner's use of stream of consciousness. McGonigle stated that he sees his work in conversation with Faulkner in terms of place, place as an anchor for the writer:


   I think Faulkner has always been there ... It's like he never

   really left the homeplace ... and so while I was in Dublin I was

   really still in Patchogue ... which would lead a French reader to

   Jacque Rigaut and discovering as I did he had invented LORD

   PATCHOGUE after being on Long Island in the 1920s and seeing those

   signs and saying the word Patchogue as a French person might 60

   miles to no way out ... (Letter, February 2017)


This might also lead a reader to Stendhal, as previously mentioned, and while McGonigle was referring to Faulkner as a writer of the local, what McGonigle doesn't express is how his novel reflects the passage of time, or lack thereof, that exists in Faulkner's writing. His novel shares the confusion of a timeless present that Faulkner uses in his novel The Sound and the Fury , which follows different members of the Compson family: Benjy, Quentin, Jason IV, Caddy, along with the Compsons' long time caretaker, Dilsey. The first section which centers on the narrative of Benjy is notably told in stream of consciousness, because Benjy is mentally handicapped and timelines merge in his head. Events are often told not in chronological order, and oftentimes this section is described as non-linear or non-chronological, but it would be more apt to say that Benjy exists in a timeless present that folds in on itself and, at the same time, constantly expands, much as in the way McGonigle portrays time and space in St. Patrick's Day: another day in Dublin . While Benjy's perspective is written the way it is to reflect his mental handicap, 'Tom McGonigle' has something much like the same handicap; perhaps, this similarity reflects a shift in realism brought about by Beckett's perception of human nature, and that while Benjy has a mental handicap recognizable by doctors and by the people he interacts with, 'Tom' is handicapped by being human, that is to say that perhaps it is human nature to be alone and fragmented from reality. Another connection between the two works of fiction is the use of inheritance, father to son, Jason IV inheriting the Compson farm and becoming patriarch and 'Tom McGonigle' inheriting his father's money earned from working forty-nine years at the American Can Company. It can be argued that both sons fail with their charges; the farm falls to rot and ruin, while 'Tom' manages only to get across Dublin on his late father's dime, episodic perhaps, but not the most epic use of coin.

Even with its lineage of literary giants, even with its winning the Notre Dame Review Book Prize, there is an important question that needs to be asked concerning McGonigle's newest novel. Why were McGonigle's other novels reviewed by such sources as the New York Times Book Review and the Chicago Tribune , while this book has received little to no critical credit in America? (The only exception being the American Book Review , which has recently published "Portrait of McGonigle," by Jane Rosenberg Laforge in its November/December issue, currently available online.)

What might explain this phenomenon of lost interest in McGonigle's work is its heritage of realism and immigration. To borrow from McGonigle's own work on the novel, realism is "soiled," and Saint Patrick's Day is rooted in a long line of literary realism, and the novel tries to claim nothing else. It seems to be an immigrant itself, and publishing is only important or congratulatory dependent upon the place you have originated; Irish heritage and the Irish-American experience has long been covered in earlier decades, but in this new century it is considered somewhat passe, is overlooked, and perhaps this is a continuance of a populace's ignorance of Irish tradition.

The problem with reviews of McGonigle's newest novel is that although some of them might admit there is something going on with his use of time and tradition, they do not fully explain its use. In a blurb, Nuala Ni' Dhomnaill states "[McGonigle] puts a certain period of Dublin literary history before our eyes with freshness and honesty. Not only that but by his skillful use of modernist techniques he gives the 'Irish novel' a long outstanding and much deserved kick up the arse into the 21st century."

Saint Patrick's Day uses modernist techniques, techniques influenced greatly by the Irish writers Joyce and Beckett, but it was published in a time that is very much post-Joyce and very much post-Beckett. This is the 21st century, the literary period wherein an overcrowded AWP hall of two hundred plus aspiring writers, editors, professors, reviewers, journalists and publishers give thunderous applause to the sound of "the last nail in the coffin [of realism]." There are no more rules. Perhaps that is the problem with McGonigle's book. Saint Patrick's Day has rules and a lineage and it owns these things. Unlike Egan and Fowler, two very contemporary writers, who would like to shove realism over a cliff, claiming that experimentation, such as a section of a novel's being entirely told from the perspective of a PowerPoint presentation, is the preferred way to write. They forget, however, that this experiment, too, could be argued to have roots in psychological realism, that because of the increasing proximity of technology in our lives, a perspective from technology might be the mutation of Stendhal's depiction of the battle of Waterloo.

The only differences between McGonigle's claims and Fowler's are that, currently, historical roots are only important in certain circumstances, and describing how your novel is like others one hundred and two hundred years ago does not excite the current readership of America as much as does throwing up your fist and claiming a mode of writing to be dead. McGonigle foresaw this as an issue when his article, "A Writing Life", was published in 2002 in The Notre Dame Review :


   You can go to Google.com and plug in my name which I share with a

   lawyer and a priest; you can read excerpts from those reviews both

   by me and about the books. Google only goes back a few years and as

   the kids say, who cares about the old shit, anyway


.


Joyce is still revered; Beckett is still revered; Faulkner is still revered, but contemporary writers who follow in their footsteps are not. Realism is viewed as soiled and has been viewed as stanch, stiff necked, and outdated for some time now, but the fault cannot be put on the shoulders of McGonigle, but rather the short sightedness of American critics, popular authors, and reviewers.

While McGonigle might disapprove of labels being put on his novels, or himself as an author, there is an importance to his biography. As he told Dr. Miriam Nyhan during the interview on Glucksman Ireland House NYU Radio Hour, his grandparents were shipped out of Ireland to go to work when they were twelve, and their--and perhaps his--identity might be described as that of Irish extraction. He went to Beloit College and then in 1964 studied abroad at University College, Dublin. This is important, both because of the time when Saint Patrick's Day was published and who the novel is about. The elephant in the room is the unspoken truth that Thomas McGonigle is a white, American-born male writing about a white, American-born male, who is having an identity crisis while abroad in another country. This is not something new for McGonigle to write about, nor is this new writing territory for Irish-American writers. McGonigle's novel, Going to Patchogue , published by Dalkey Archive Press in 1992, concerns a similar protagonist and motif; however, that novel was praised for its use of stream of consciousness and its ability, while using various modernist techniques, to stick together a cohesive reading experience. Saint Patrick's Day has not received such praise, nor has it had the critical success that his earlier novels have had. Saint Patrick's Day: another day in Dublin was published by Notre Dame Press in 2016, the year of a presidential election in which U.S. presidential debates often concerned immigration, and immigrant experiences (stories, poems, memoirs, and novels) took the literary world by storm. It might be argued that part of the reason Saint Patrick's Day has been overlooked is because it has been taken at surface level, and that it was published at time when an immigrant novel written by a white, American-born male is seen by many as politically incorrect and counter-intuitive to the cause, almost superfluous. This could not be further from the truth, though white-male is the least trendy of contemporary sub-cultures. The exploration of self in immigrant texts often contemplates and complicates issues of human nature, but also, specifically, contemplates and complicates issues of identity. In his critical essay, "Joyce's Merrimanic Heroine: Molly vs. Bloom in Midnight Court," James A. W. Heffernan argues that "conspicuous by its absence from this multicultural stew [in Ulysses] is anything explicitly Gaelic, anciently Irish." This is wrong. The themes of problematic identities (national and religious and writer/bard) are explicitly represented in Joyce's text, and these themes, while not exclusively Gaelic, are "explicitly Gaelic, anciently Irish." That is why they can be traced in Joyce's work, and in Beckett's work, and in McGonigle's work. On page three of his novel, McGonigle writes,


   The Americans came dressed in white socks and London Fog raincoats.

   I lost my white socks and kept the J.C. Penney raincoat which was

   soiled down the right front side with dried red paint after

   brushing against wet posters in the anarchist office in Glasgow

   where I had visited: Americans never wore soiled clothing being

   afraid of getting run over by a truck ...


Perhaps, to be an American abroad is now viewed in the same light as realism--soiled, because the American readership is so hyper-politicized with agendas that historicism seemingly has little value anymore. The fear of being run over by a truck has now been replaced with a literary "musical intimidation" of the twentieth century.

Saint Patrick's Day: another day in Dublin should be read because of the company it keeps in a timeless present: Faulkner; Beckett; Joyce; Beyle; also, two other French authors I have not mentioned yet, Marcel Proust and Louis-Ferdinand Celine. The last two, although it is regrettable they come so late in this argument, will, perhaps, bring us closer to a conclusion and a better understanding of the importance of what McGonigle's latest novel is representing by its existence in 2017. Certain similarities can be drawn between the influences of St. Patrick's Day that have been already mentioned and the writing of Louis-Ferdinand Celine, if one can forget for a moment Celine's anti-Semitism and think only of his fiction, specifically his first novel Journey to the End of the Night .

Celine, McGonigle, and Joyce share not only the mythic quality of a work of fiction's being both creative and biographic but also a dark, dry humor, and a yearning to render on the page a character's chaotic subconscious attempting to find a kind of order in the physical world, creating characters less idealistic, in the romantic sense, and more realistic. The last two are also represented in the works of Beckett and Proust.

Marcel Proust's tour de force A la recherche du temps perdu (Remembrance of Things Past orIn Search of Lost Time ) tells the autobiography of an unnamed (except for a single "Marcel"), first-person narrator often with stream of consciousness narration. The closest allusions to McGonigle's work can be drawn near the end of Swann s Way when the narrator envisions visiting different places, but his failing health makes elaborate travel impossible, so instead he walks in the Champs-Elysees. One might compare this to the way that 'Tom McGonigle' walks about Dublin, going from pub to pub, because he fails to come to grips with the past and the present. His failing health is a failing psychological health preventing him from fully existing in the present, which keeps him from moving fully into the present, or on into the future. Going back to the very end of Swann's Way , we see the narrator expressing grief about the fleeting nature of places, physical places that no longer exist where they used to, creating a lamentation about the passing of time and the decay of the present, which directly correlates to the timeless present that McGonigle exists in.

Madison Smartt Bell said of McGonigle's first book, The Corpse Dream of N. Petkov , "Here's a fine effort to capture disappearing history--history that vanishes by being forgotten ..." This essay is, in part, an effort to capture a disappearing history, an effort to capture the importance of a literary lineage that is vanishing, not because it is being forgotten, but because award-winning authors and critics are consciously refuting its validity as a contemporary means of fiction.

Thomas McGonigle's newest novel, St. Patrick's Day: another day in Dublin , represents, then, not only a lineage of realism, but also a tangible proof that great contemporary novels can be written while still honoring the past. This novel's existence in today's literary marketplace represents a timeless present that deserves to be read, studied, and reviewed, another display of why the American readership needs to get over its fear of "musical intimidation."

Thomas McGonigle

Thomas McGonigle was born in 1944 in Patchogue, Long Island. Throughout his life, he has lived in Brooklyn, New York; Dublin, Ireland; Sofia, Bulgaria; Douglas, Arizona; and Manhattan, his current home. McGonigle has written extensively on the topic of Ireland and Irish writers, and is the founder and editor of Adrift (The American Irish Cultural Project). He holds degrees from University College, Dublin, Beloit College, Columbia University, and Hollins College, where he earned an M.A. in English in 1970. McGonigle writes regularly for periodicals like The Guardian, The Washington Post , the Chicago Tribune , and the Los Angeles Times . His prose and poetry have been published in Poetry Ireland, Bomb, The Gorey Detail, Broadsheet , and Screw , among others. McGonigle's latest novel, St. Patrick's Day: another day in Dublin , described as a musing "on death, sex, lost love, and Irish immigrant history" by Notre Dame Press, was the winner of the 2016 Notre Dame Review Book Prize.

--I. L. S.


Sunday, June 5, 2022

WHAT I AM DOING. WHEN AN ARTIST STOPS PAINTING?

 


                           WHAT I AM DOING

               

              WHEN AN ARTIST STOPS PAINTING


But is the reader perhaps opposed to digression? Does he believe in a goal not only for ordinary life, but life as well?  Is he longing for a story with a beginning and end?  This is contrary to the noble purpose of literature, which knows neither beginning nor end, and wants only to give form and shimmer to the continuous present in life.  Let the reader beware and not allow himself to be distracted from the art of strolling.

              From SPEAKING TO CLIO by Alberto Savinio



       AND AGAIN CHANGED: John Wesley

A version in prose.


If only there has/had been the precise sentence describing at the moment: John (Jack) Wesley and indeed this sentence could be describing the person pushing the keys on a computer in a bright sunny room on East First  Street in  Manhattan in the month of December though this man hesitates as he did not write that sentence by Alberto Savinio in 1938 but read it recently  once again ---having read it many years ago--- because he had come to realize he is neither a biographer, nor a memoir writer so why did he type many pages describing visits with John Wesley and attempting to describe a knowing of this man and some of the people Wesley knew since some date in the early 1970s in Manhattan and now being in the summer of 2022... and the artist is dead.


But the last time that the writer who is now writing felt in some way free was back in January 2020 driving about in the desert of southern Arizona with an English woman who had come to the United States for the first time to drive about with me who she had met for the first time in Dublin so many years before and who now lived at Lordington, a great house near Chichester... a tangling of memory of course, you might ask and why when we are here wanting--- to read about John Wesley, an artist who is no longer painting. 

But even this sentence seemingly complex is not complex enough...


OR THEN.  The other day, another year, a Monday in the month of March, in a sunny three window room overlooking Washington Square Park, I asked Jack Wesley why he began to paint.  

I don’t know.

Why did you continue to paint?

I liked doing it.

Why have you stopped painting?

I am not now inclined to paint.

                                                       ***

                                      But why not?   

Already not belonging to life yet not swept up by the void.                           --- Georgi Ivanov


                                                              +++

John Wesley is in the first generation of Pop artists or is it the second?  He is in his 85th year.  [ONCE UPON A TIME] 

Seven months ago [once upon a time] Wesley stopped leaving his apartment to go down for lunch at the North Square restaurant on the corner of MacDougal and Waverly Place which had become over the years a daily activity.  Now, the stairs down into the place were too difficult and the stepping up and down at the curb in order to cross the intersection had proven frightening and dangerous since his step had become unsteady. 

                                                         +++

I had come to talk to him of my recent trip to southern Arizona and New Mexico, along the Mexican border...


Thursday, February 24, 2022

JOHN WESLEY--- THE PAINTER--- DIED 10 FEBRUARY 2022

I am copying this from a post done now it seems in the ancient times of this January 


from WHAT I AM DOING: AND AGAIN CHANGED, JOHN WESLEY

      I have been for a long time writing about the painter John Wesley who was in the first generation of pop artists: a book of memory going back to my first meeting of him in the early 1970s as the husband of the writer Hannah Green (author of THE DEAD OF THE HOUSE and LITTLE SAINT; she was a student of Vladimir Nabokov at Wellesley and published "Mr. Nabokov")... for many years Jack has been unable to leave his apartment on Washington Square and is now at another residence. There have been two great exhibitions of his work: at MOMA's PS 1 in 2000 and in Venice in 2009 a massive exhibition of his work was staged by Fondazione Prada.  A selection of his work is on permanent display at the Judd Foundation in Marfa, Texas.


from: WHAT I AM DOING: AND AGAIN CHANGED, JOHN WESLEY


      Hannah still seems to be here.  

    But I can’t sound like those old relatives Hannah always talked about.  I know in Los Angeles you would expect a lot of people to talk about ghosts and voices and spirits and all the rest of those things but it wasn’t the way it was—at least for me--- we were there and they were there and it was all so real, I guess you could say and then someone wasn’t there and that was hard to understand, it is always hard to understand      really understand                how someone isn’t there anymore, Elman isn’t here anymore,  MacShane isn’t here anymore, Hannah isn’t here anymore… but I am not so sure… but I am sure I fell, I really fell not here in this room, did I fall     but in the hall.          I fell in that long hall             I fell..
Here in this room I have fallen, it would be easy to say, it  would be grand to say: here I have fallen, didn’t MacArthur say, I have returned, and he was walking in the surf in the Philippines and I wonder when did he change his trousers and shoes or boots… remember those pictures?... you’ve only seen them in documentaries, but we saw them in newsreels that was in the summer I think and I fell in August and in October.  
Not in this room, really, but in this apartment, I have fallen and I can hear them saying that in a movie, he’s fallen down, he’s down and I felt myself down when I fell in the hall. 
I didn’t hit my head, I knew that was not what you were supposed to do, you are not supposed to hit your head…
Does that make sense?  
People are always talking about hard heads.  Remember when they talked about hard hats… I guess they all went away or something happened to them.  You still see people wearing hard hats but they don’t call those guys hard hats, as far as I know.
Do you ever get the feeling you’re in a hole and some little guys are digging right under your feet and you feel yourself slipping down each day but you’re not really in a hole, you are still right here but you have this feeling in the bottoms of your feet--- you could say it but people will say you’re nuts--- the feet are saying they are going down but the rest of your body is trying to say, no, that ain’t happening and what’s gotten into you and if I was really in a hole I wouldn’t have fallen as all you can do is fall forward like in the movies when the guys went over the top or climbed out of the foxhole, always one of the guys gets it right away and is slipping back into the hole and the other guys just had to keep going though one maybe lingers for a moment and the older gruff know-it-all gives him a yank: he’s done for and then there is always a lull in the movie and someone slips back and finds his friend dead and you don’t see any gore because that only came later, the gore and all the stuff to make it seem believable but they always leave out the feelings so then they had to ladle out the gore as no one really believes this is for real with the slimy red slippery stuff and all you keep wondering if they are using cow guts and gore or if it was a black and white film they used chocolate syrup I was told by a friend who had a friend who worked in one of the studios.  What a mess that must have been but they weren’t allowed to show too much of it so I guess it wasn’t that bad.
I fell.  I don’t want to fall again.  No one wants to fall again after they have fallen once or like me, have fallen twice.  
I have fallen twice and do not want to fall again. Then, it gets too much like Good Friday.  I went along with Hannah, but it was just too distant from me.  Christ falls three times and there are all those women.  Hannah wanted to see the Shroud of Turin, is it… but we had decided for France and that trip to Spain.  MacShane liked Italy but I went where I was taken.  I didn’t know what to say in Italy.  Prada didn’t take me on a gondola and I knew not to buy one of those windup gondolas I saw them selling in San Marco.  You wind it up and it goes up and down as if it was in choppy seas.
Jack had an eye for the windup things… he used to have go down to Chambers Street and there were all these great stores along it filled with stuff.  That’s where he got the bird clock.  
Hannah would take the battery out and I would put it back in.  That was then, I think.
The bird clock is not in the room.  I think it was once and I remember it as being one of those objects, as they say, only Jack could find, a clock that made bird sounds, a different one for every hour.  I don’t know if it did 24 but I know it made 12 and then repeated itself. 12 birds, one for each hour and the hands of the clock should have been some sort of feather design but they weren’t, Hannah knew something about birds and it bothered her that some of the calls weren’t very clear and seemed more like a person imitating what a bird sounded like.  
Jack liked the bird sounds even if they were made by humans as they didn’t toll your hours away and bring your death closer the way a church bell did or the bells ringing out the hours in public buildings…
  Of course, the bells ringing allowed me to quote Anthony Burgess to his knowing when you heard the bells ringing in Christian places of old:  the Mussulmen are coming, the Mussulmen are coming and this is why the bells are not ringing in Turkey because they know what the bells really mean, even if they say they don’t for their own purposes…
There was no reply…
But you should know the room is not sterile, isn’t that the word people sometimes are saying, it’s very sterile in here as if like so many things… how should anyone know what a sterile room is unless they are some sort of medical doctor and anyway have you ever met a doctor who gave a rat’s behind when it came right down to it about germs?
    When I first got to the city they used to have these walk-in doctors and for five dollars they would listen to your symptoms, give you some sort of jar of something or other and a note to the boss… the last one like that was down on Spring Street, when they had factories all over the place…
Things change, they are always saying and they don’t have those doctors anymore.
                                                          ***
Death changes things.  What a cliché.   Yes, people die but no, people is not the exact word:  my father died, my mother died, Hannah died… and I guess it is a good thing we didn’t start with such a sentence. 
Probably better to say, certain people have been forgotten, though their names remain...  but damn:  what do I really know about that person, what can I call up?
I was born, Wesley says.  
Can there be a more obvious statement a human being can make?  If I add in California the statement is surrounded by all the illusions Hollywood so obviously and capably delivers and no one wants to have it contradicted by anything that might take away from the picture a person has formed when they hear: I was born in California and if I revise my sentence to:  I was born in Los Angeles, California, I have been removed from something which I can only tell you about when I tell you about  of all places the Rue Charlemagne in Conques--- what a grand name for a broken cobbled lane--- and Pierre was kicking the wall         not hard as he was a very old man and saying what Hannah translated as : this is here, this is here.  This is real.  I don’t remember the French but I am sure it sounds better in French, everything sounded better in French, I was always thinking, even when people were ordering in the bakery: it was more than just going in to get a loaf of bread when it was being said in French…         
There is nothing to kick when you say, I was born in Los Angeles, California.  Once I heard on the radio, as Bill sometimes had the radio on in the studio.  It was just a line:  Home is…I forgot.  I don’t know who sang it.  Home is…  I forgot.

Sunday, January 2, 2022

from WHAT I AM DOING: AND AGAIN CHANGED, JOHN WESLEY

      I have been for a long time writing about the painter John Wesley who was in the first generation of pop artists: a book of memory going back to my first meeting of him in the early 1970s as the husband of the writer Hannah Green (author of THE DEAD OF THE HOUSE and LITTLE SAINT; she was a student of Vladimir Nabokov at Wellesley and published "Mr. Nabokov")... for many years Jack has been unable to leave his apartment on Washington Square and is now at another residence. There have been two great exhibitions of his work: at MOMA's PS 1 in 2000 and in Venice in 2009 a massive exhibition of his work was staged by Fondazione Prada.  A selection of his work is on permanent display at the Judd Foundation in Marfa, Texas.


from: WHAT I AM DOING: AND AGAIN CHANGED, JOHN WESLEY


      Hannah still seems to be here.  

    But I can’t sound like those old relatives Hannah always talked about.  I know in Los Angeles you would expect a lot of people to talk about ghosts and voices and spirits and all the rest of those things but it wasn’t the way it was—at least for me--- we were there and they were there and it was all so real, I guess you could say and then someone wasn’t there and that was hard to understand, it is always hard to understand      really understand                how someone isn’t there anymore, Elman isn’t here anymore,  MacShane isn’t here anymore, Hannah isn’t here anymore… but I am not so sure… but I am sure I fell, I really fell not here in this room, did I fall     but in the hall.          I fell in that long hall             I fell..
Here in this room I have fallen, it would be easy to say, it  would be grand to say: here I have fallen, didn’t MacArthur say, I have returned, and he was walking in the surf in the Philippines and I wonder when did he change his trousers and shoes or boots… remember those pictures?... you’ve only seen them in documentaries, but we saw them in newsreels that was in the summer I think and I fell in August and in October.  
Not in this room, really, but in this apartment, I have fallen and I can hear them saying that in a movie, he’s fallen down, he’s down and I felt myself down when I fell in the hall. 
I didn’t hit my head, I knew that was not what you were supposed to do, you are not supposed to hit your head…
Does that make sense?  
People are always talking about hard heads.  Remember when they talked about hard hats… I guess they all went away or something happened to them.  You still see people wearing hard hats but they don’t call those guys hard hats, as far as I know.
Do you ever get the feeling you’re in a hole and some little guys are digging right under your feet and you feel yourself slipping down each day but you’re not really in a hole, you are still right here but you have this feeling in the bottoms of your feet--- you could say it but people will say you’re nuts--- the feet are saying they are going down but the rest of your body is trying to say, no, that ain’t happening and what’s gotten into you and if I was really in a hole I wouldn’t have fallen as all you can do is fall forward like in the movies when the guys went over the top or climbed out of the foxhole, always one of the guys gets it right away and is slipping back into the hole and the other guys just had to keep going though one maybe lingers for a moment and the older gruff know-it-all gives him a yank: he’s done for and then there is always a lull in the movie and someone slips back and finds his friend dead and you don’t see any gore because that only came later, the gore and all the stuff to make it seem believable but they always leave out the feelings so then they had to ladle out the gore as no one really believes this is for real with the slimy red slippery stuff and all you keep wondering if they are using cow guts and gore or if it was a black and white film they used chocolate syrup I was told by a friend who had a friend who worked in one of the studios.  What a mess that must have been but they weren’t allowed to show too much of it so I guess it wasn’t that bad.
I fell.  I don’t want to fall again.  No one wants to fall again after they have fallen once or like me, have fallen twice.  
I have fallen twice and do not want to fall again. Then, it gets too much like Good Friday.  I went along with Hannah, but it was just too distant from me.  Christ falls three times and there are all those women.  Hannah wanted to see the Shroud of Turin, is it… but we had decided for France and that trip to Spain.  MacShane liked Italy but I went where I was taken.  I didn’t know what to say in Italy.  Prada didn’t take me on a gondola and I knew not to buy one of those windup gondolas I saw them selling in San Marco.  You wind it up and it goes up and down as if it was in choppy seas.
Jack had an eye for the windup things… he used to have go down to Chambers Street and there were all these great stores along it filled with stuff.  That’s where he got the bird clock.  
Hannah would take the battery out and I would put it back in.  That was then, I think.
The bird clock is not in the room.  I think it was once and I remember it as being one of those objects, as they say, only Jack could find, a clock that made bird sounds, a different one for every hour.  I don’t know if it did 24 but I know it made 12 and then repeated itself. 12 birds, one for each hour and the hands of the clock should have been some sort of feather design but they weren’t, Hannah knew something about birds and it bothered her that some of the calls weren’t very clear and seemed more like a person imitating what a bird sounded like.  
Jack liked the bird sounds even if they were made by humans as they didn’t toll your hours away and bring your death closer the way a church bell did or the bells ringing out the hours in public buildings…
  Of course, the bells ringing allowed me to quote Anthony Burgess to his knowing when you heard the bells ringing in Christian places of old:  the Mussulmen are coming, the Mussulmen are coming and this is why the bells are not ringing in Turkey because they know what the bells really mean, even if they say they don’t for their own purposes…
There was no reply…
But you should know the room is not sterile, isn’t that the word people sometimes are saying, it’s very sterile in here as if like so many things… how should anyone know what a sterile room is unless they are some sort of medical doctor and anyway have you ever met a doctor who gave a rat’s behind when it came right down to it about germs?
    When I first got to the city they used to have these walk-in doctors and for five dollars they would listen to your symptoms, give you some sort of jar of something or other and a note to the boss… the last one like that was down on Spring Street, when they had factories all over the place…
Things change, they are always saying and they don’t have those doctors anymore.
                                                          ***
Death changes things.  What a cliché.   Yes, people die but no, people is not the exact word:  my father died, my mother died, Hannah died… and I guess it is a good thing we didn’t start with such a sentence. 
Probably better to say, certain people have been forgotten, though their names remain...  but damn:  what do I really know about that person, what can I call up?
I was born, Wesley says.  
Can there be a more obvious statement a human being can make?  If I add in California the statement is surrounded by all the illusions Hollywood so obviously and capably delivers and no one wants to have it contradicted by anything that might take away from the picture a person has formed when they hear: I was born in California and if I revise my sentence to:  I was born in Los Angeles, California, I have been removed from something which I can only tell you about when I tell you about  of all places the Rue Charlemagne in Conques--- what a grand name for a broken cobbled lane--- and Pierre was kicking the wall         not hard as he was a very old man and saying what Hannah translated as : this is here, this is here.  This is real.  I don’t remember the French but I am sure it sounds better in French, everything sounded better in French, I was always thinking, even when people were ordering in the bakery: it was more than just going in to get a loaf of bread when it was being said in French…         
There is nothing to kick when you say, I was born in Los Angeles, California.  Once I heard on the radio, as Bill sometimes had the radio on in the studio.  It was just a line:  Home is…I forgot.  I don’t know who sang it.  Home is…  I forgot.


Saturday, October 23, 2021

AN AMERICAN IS A DISEASED SCRAP OF HUMANITY

This novel was written now some time ago and remains unpublished: about a young American who goes from Dublin in the Spring of 1965 to the DDR, or as it was more commonly called: East Germany.  I have long thought of it as A Beginning of the Sixties of the last century...a premature understanding of "an American."  



AN AMERICAN IS A DISEASED SCRAP OF HUMANITY

from JUST LIKE THAT a novel as a beginning of the Sixties of the last century...


The I of the novel has spent much of the night [in the spring of 1965] next to the monument to the Battle of the Nations on the outskirts of Leipzig in what was then called  the German  Democratic Republic (DDR).


 Martin who has been with this "I" all day and now in the late night begins to speak:  

Don't sit there anymore.  The night is done with.  You are an American and you can't deny it. It is written on your face, in the book you carry next to your heart and how you would like to insert that book into your heart if you could.  That little greenish book, the colour of corpses in comic books which the frontier guards will look at and hand back to you as if you were diseased.  Did you feel that as you crossed our country on the way to Berlin?  Surely you did. You are so sensitive, if you say so, as you please.  I know that.  An American is a diseased scrap of humanity who does not what it is: just a creature who will die and before dying will grow old and not all the money, not all the wishes, not all the king's men will be able to step in and put a stop to the lines appearing at the corners of your eyes, at the corners of your mouth that has kissed my lips and which will spot the backs of your hands with those false stigmatas of saintliness: are they not saints for having endured this life--- but in your United States of American, from what I have read, the old are put to the field and turned into manure, the young have not the experience of being around their old people and the aged are left to rot.  But even to  think of death--- what a heresy--- how the stakes must be kept in readiness all across America because death is what denies the ever bigger future and the happiness always around the corner if you work very hard and have the boss's dick up your ass and you don't comment on how small his dick is.


Martin had walked a little way from the monument and I could see him pacing back and forth beyond the low hedge. I sat with the stone of the monument to my back, as I have said, the bullets stitching a death across my chest.  Was I not James Connolly tied to a chair because I was unable to stand to meet the English guns.


(the opening and the ending of this novel were published long ago in THE READING ROOM edited by Barbara Probst Solomon...


Monday, September 6, 2021

MY INTERVIEW WITH ALAIN ROBBE-GRILLET

 Interview: Alain Robbe-Grillet

Author: McGonigle, Thomas


In an interview, novelist Alain Robbe-Grillet discusses his literary style and the publication of his new novel "Repetition." Among other things, he cites the reasons why his ideas are known but his works are forgotten.


Alain Robbe-Grillet occupies that paradoxical position not uncommon to avant-garde writers: He is both famous and obscure; his ideas are well known but his work much less so. Nevertheless, he remains a major figure in the landscape of postwar French letters and film. After publishing The Erasers fifty years ago, he became a fierce advocate for what came to be known as the nouveau roman. In a book of critical essays, Fora New Novel (1963), and by the example of his own now canonical novels The Voyeur (1955), Jealousy (1957), and In the Labyrinth (1959), Robbe-Grillet pointed the way toward a fiction that eschewed psychological motivation in favor of pure, almost analytical description of physical reality. His ideas were shared by writers such as Michel Butor, Marguerite Duras, Claude Simon, Robert Pinget, and Nathalie Sarraute. A strongly contentious figure, he garnered many enemies as well as advocates. (Vladimir Nabokov was one of his most prominent fans.) In 1984, Robbe-Grillet's autobiography, Ghosts in the Mirror, sparked renewed interest in his work because of its revelations about his life during World War II and his apparent rejection of some of the tenets of the nouveau roman. He has directed six films and is the author of Last Year at Marienbad, the 1961 art-house classic directed by Alain Resnais. A new work of fiction, Repetition, is now appearing in the United States after a twenty-year hiatus of English-language publication. Viewed as a sort of anthology of his previous fiction, Repetition was a great critical and popular success across Europe. Much less intimidating in person than you might expect-judging by photographs and the sometimes dogmatic tack of his critical articles-the eighty-year-old Robbe-Grillet was a little anxious when we met in his well-appointed apartment in the posh Parisian suburb of Neuilly-sur-Seine. His wife of many years, Catherine, was under-going an eye operation that morning, yet he was gently concerned about my comfort as the conversation began.

THOMAS McGONIGLE: How has your reading of The Erasers changed from fifty years ago to now?

ALAIN ROBBE-GRILLET: There's a great continuity to the work, yet I do feel like there's a lot of change as well. The earlier books are clarified by the later books. So if you've read The Erasers, you will find it further illuminated by Jealousy. TM: Readers often first encounter your theories of the novel-particularly your ideas about the flatness of characterization. Does this discourage them from reading the fiction?

ARG: That's a big problem.

TM: You wrote For a New Novel, which condemns metaphor entirely, and at almost the same time, you were writing Jealousy, which is a festival of metaphor.

ARG: True. But it was my impression that the reader was reading both For a New Novel and Jealousy. Unfortunately, this was not the case. I just received a Vietnamese translation of For a New Novel, which is the only one of my works that's been translated into that language. So in Vietnam, I will be known as the person who theorizes a new kind of novel, but readers there will not have access to any of my actual novels. As I said, it's a big problem.

TM: As far as your reputation, you are in this strange position-you are both well known and yet, in many quarters, somewhat forgotten.

ARG: Since the publication of Repetition, I've gone to bookstores to sign books and o there's a crowd of only young people. No old people. Let's put it this way: I was once fashionable. And when I was in fashion, nobody read my books. For instance, the first year when I was really in vogue my novel Jealousy sold five hundred copies for the entire year. But Repetition has sold fifty thousand copies. When I started to gather readers, I was already out of fashion. But when I was in style, I couldn't live on my writing. Now I can live on my writing very nicely. Nice apartment here, a chateau in the country. You know, I come from very modest origins.

TM: Academics preserved your name and made possible your current revival.

ARG: I had a dialogue with William Styron at one point when he came here, in a lovely setting, to join a conference about what is literature. Styron picked up the subject of the difference between literature for professors and literature for readers. he said that literature for common readers rises out of your body, that it comes out of your guts. Yet he soon understood that he couldn't last the two-hour program on this subject of what comes out of your guts. So Styron then started to go on somewhat abstractly, sounding like a professor himself. The problem or advantage is that university people, the professors, they have the time to read. Does your average reader have that same kind of time? Time to read and to really think?

TM: I wasn't attacking your academic readers, but rather noting that during the years you weren't publishing novels, the academy, not the marketplace, maintained your reputation.

ARG: Well, it's rather populist to say nasty things about professors. Saying bad things about professors is like agreeing with Le Pen. But my books do sell. In China, I am the most translated French author. Repetition was a best-seller in France and Germany. I live very well. [Leaves the room and returns with a framed poster.] This is what my copyrights have bought me, the Chateau du Mesnil-au-Grain in Normandy. When I die it will go to the state and become a foundation to preserve my papers.

TM: In 1984, your memoir, Ghosts in the Mirror, appeared. You were quoted as saying, "I have never spoken of anything but myself." In light of such a statement, how should we read the novels and theory that made you famous? Are all of your novels disguised autobiography?

ARG: It's true for all writers. Faulkner is in all his novels. So is Flaubert. My novel Jealousy is absolutely autobiographical. I lived in that house. I have photographs of that house. I was one of the three characters in the novel. What's strange is that this was received by critics as a novel without an author, as the most abstract of all novels. The Voyeur is set in Brittany, where I was born. The chief difference is that I did not murder a young girl. Yet the idea of doing such a thing was in me. A very famous psychoanalyst told me, "It's a good thing that you wrote that novel, because it was your psychoanalyst couch. If you hadn't, you might have murdered a young woman."

TM: With the publication of your first novel in twenty years, Repetition, I am reminded of Gertrude Stein's quote, "There is no such thing as repetition, only insistence." What you are insisting upon in this novel?

ARG: The Ghost in the Mirror and Angelique were also...

TM: But Angelique has not been translated into English. We're talking about English.

ARG: I'm sorry; but just because they haven't been translated into English doesn't mean they don't exist. There was supposed to be a conference ten years ago in St. Louis, and the university there announced, "Mr. Robbe-Grillet will speak French." So a minister who is interested in literature calls the university and is told by a professor that I do not speak English. The minister replies, "He could have made an effort to learn English, because God wrote his Bible in English."

TM: Back to my question: Why write another novel? Why write Repetition?

ARG: I don't know. But I do insist on insisting. Literature has survived Hitler and Stalin. It will survive Chirac and Bush. It survives.

TM: Richard Howard, your translator, has said that he thought this new novel was an anthology of all your previous work, with an interlude for fucking a teenage girl.

ARG: Well, Howard is a homosexual. And to him there's nothing more disgusting than women. He even announced twenty years ago that he was going to refuse to translate any books in which there's any sexual activity with women. To dedicate himself entirely to homosexual literature. Even in his translation of Baudelaire, when it gets too sexual, he cuts off Baudelaire's balls. Anyway, the statement is stupid. Because since The Voyeurwas written, there have been thirteen-year-old girls getting fucked in my books.

TM: In publications like the New Yorker or the New York Times, there have been attacks on what is called "difficult" writing, literary writing. Some critics wonder why popular novels like those by James Patterson aren't embraced by literary tastemakers.

ARG: I can't even comment. If you're going to read Repetition, you have to have philosophical training, and it would help to know Kierkegaard. And I'm perfectly aware of the fact that readers without that education can also read it on another level, but my books are especially approachable by people who have some philosophical background.

TM: I ask because you have said that the reason you teach is to encourage young people to believe in high culture. Now they read that, perhaps, James Patterson's novels are the equal or better than, for instance, William Gaddis's.

ARG: What they say is abominable. My job is not to write best-sellers; I hope to write long sellers. Young writers, it seems, are no longer that interested in culture per se. They are interested, instead, in having a career in literature. If you're going to have a career, then you may well not have much else. There's a danger in this disappearance of culture, because it's not only the literary culture that's disappearing; it's also scientific culture. We're going to become a society where the people will know only how to push buttons. My grandfather was a teacher. In his time the idea was to raise someone to become a teacher, not a professor, but an elementary school teacher. The idea then was to raise people up toward the elite. Now, of course, the word "elite" is pejorative. When Pompidou became president, he founded a committee to defend the French language because he saw a threat of homogenization. he needed a general, a priest, and an avant-garde writer, so I ended up part of this committee. We were rather close at the time, and I told him that "Defense of the French Language" was not a good name for this committee. I told Pompidou that the name or idea should be "The Extension of the French Language and Defense of Its Purity." "You're right," he said. "But the purer it stays, the less we can extend it." I answered, "If you want to fight the battle with basic English, you have to have a basic French." I made the choice of French-of pure French and syntax. You'll notice mysteries are complicated, but the syntax is simple. To be a novelist is to see, to look with words, to find the exact words.

TM: In 1966, you said that the erotic photograph had more of a future than the erotic film.

ARG: That's possible. It's not idiotic; it's possible that I said that.

TM: Are you happy with the proliferation of eroticism on video or the Internet?

ARG: I can't say, because I don't use the Internet.

TM: So you've lost interest in the erotic.

ARG: No. I've lost interest in technology. If you have to be connected to the Internet to be interested in eroticism, then you're in trouble.

TM: You chose not to have children. Do you find any advantages to that choice now that you're in your eighties?

ARG: Yes, a lot. When I see all my friends that have children. Parenthood tends to make them sick. Their children take drugs, they don't work at school, all they have is problems.

TM: My daughter is at a Lycee in Nantes to learn French. In my old age, when I'm eating oatmeal, I hope she will read me her translation of Celine's Bagatelles pour un massacre.

ARG: If she agrees, but who knows with the young. I knew Celine, and, like Kafka, he had a great sense humor. He wrote two great books, but after that his stupidity got the best of him.

TM: When I interviewed Julian Greene when he was about ninety-four, I asked him what he had to look forward to, and he said he looked forward to purgatory.

ARG: He was a Christian, and that changes things. I'm not a tarot-card reader. I don't know what the future will bring. By nature, though, I'm optimistic.

TM: Even given the horrors of the last century?

ARG: I think it's a genetic-it's a question of genetics. Maybe they'll find the gene or the chromosome.

TM: But I find that being Celtic, as you are, that I'm constitutionally pessimistic.

ARG: The Celts have a sense of humor, which is more or less like Jewish humor. And you can say there's a sad side to the Jewish spirit too, but the Celts and the Jews are pre-despair.

TM: You mentioned your wife. You have been married for fifty years.

ARG: Well, I had my young mistresses, and she had her young mistresses, and she still does, because she's younger than I am. And when I had, well, rather spectacular young mistresses, because I was directing movies, she remained quite content because she considered them flighty. Still, she shared my pleasure, and now I share hers.

Sidebar

My novels are absolutely autobiographical. The Voyeur is set in Brittany, where I was born. The chief difference is that I did not murder a young girl. Yet the idea of doing such a thing was in me.